Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

Kerowyn01 — Mon, 09 Jun 2008 21:14:20 GMT

i am extremely upset that you would lump every drug in to the same category. Not only do I work for one of these 'evil' pharmaceutical companies I also take a couple of medications. I totally believe in what I am doing. Adverse Event reporting is an extremely important part of the job. Even something as little as a sinus headach or the flu is reported and taken seriously! I also take allergy medications. I would have a very difficult time functioning on a daily basis without it. I lived my entire childhood being miserable because I did not take it and my mother did not like medications. Getting a prescription for it was like a God-Send. There are also people who would die without their asthma medication. We also take 'bribing' doctors to buy our medications very seriously. So before you lump everything in to one category do a little research on the hundreds of drugs that people take that are helpfull. Also most drugs are 'synthesized' using plants!! So really it's nothing more then putting the right natural ingredients together to help millions of people.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

S Bennett — Mon, 12 May 2008 19:21:59 GMT

Actually I think Dr. Mercola's comments mislead, though the issue is a valid one. There is no "dirty little secret". The "number needed to treat" is simply an alternative way to accurately represent the statistical results of medical treatment research. It is, however, a uniquely useful representation. The same method of evaluating treatment research could be applied to any treatment--medication, chiropractic therapy, accupuncture, or the myriad of unresearched products marketed from the shelf of my local drug store (were they to be submitted to real scientific proof!). It certainly is true, for example, that the magnitude of benefit from cholesterol-lowering drugs to prevent heart disease is modest. That's not the same as saying that they are useless. The "NNT" simply gives some idea of the chances of measurably benefitting from the treatment. There's no "secret" or drug company conspiracy on this.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

Chrisso — Sun, 11 May 2008 08:36:06 GMT

Does anybody else think that this is one of the most significant articles to be added on mercola for a long time?

It really shows just how disgusting and toxic and unhealthy prescription medicines are.

An NNT of 100 and more for the cholesterol drugs is beyond belief, and who could say the one person that benefited did so directly due to the drug?

Drug companies would do anything to make sure this is not common knowledge I'm sure.

It really is the most profitable industry in the world, however one of the most unjust and ethically corrupt.

Prescription drugs do no good to your body.

People need to wake up to mother nature, however to the enlightened few it is common sense.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

S. Alderson DC — Sat, 10 May 2008 11:12:00 GMT

Here's an interesting NNT to be aware of. In 1999, in the Journal of Manipulative and Physiological Therapeutics a piece of research was published. It analyzed, among other things, the percentage of people who end up in nursing homes. In the general population, you have a 50:50 shot or basically 1 out of 2 people will end up in a nursing home. People who are under regular, long term chiropractic care had a 1 in 20 chance. If my math is correct, the NNT for long term, regular chiropractic care at preventing you from ending up in a nursing home is 2.22.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

trishaspring50 — Sat, 10 May 2008 02:52:49 GMT

As a Registered Nurse I quit working in Hospitals because I felt like a Drug Dealer. Do not dare question the authority of some of the Pompus A-- Doctors as to why they are ordering a specific drug for a patient that I am in Charge of taking care of. God forbid Allopaths call one another anymore about a patient they have. That was lost in the Days of Marcus Welby.

We are losing the Good Docs and Nursing because of corporate greed, drug companies, insurance companies and general disgust with the medical system.

My Husband, an Bone Doc is getting out after 35 years, what cinched it. When a Corporate CEO from a Large hospital chain, said to him, "Your surgical numbers are down, don't you like us anymore". He retorted with, "thats because I don't scope and cut every patient that comes to your hospital"

Drug companies are out of control and treat us like idiots and so are the Hospitals owned by Big Fat Rats who could care less about care. You and I are just a number to most of them. Thanks for the info Dr Mercola

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

bombom12 — Fri, 09 May 2008 17:20:10 GMT

Hi, I recently joined and like to say something and also ask. When my son got sick a month and 1/2 ago (he's 23 months yesterday-weights 33 lbs.), wheezing, temperature, ear infection, the pediatrician prescribed amocillin and albuterol. (last year he was prescribed the same but he didn't have the ear infection, although the cold/flu, -and I gave them to him). Having read Mr. Trudeau's books -and referred to Dr. Mercola's site-, I wasn't to sure I wanted to go the same route again...and all those years of "brainwashing by the drugs companies" makes you even wonder. But I gave it a try -wanted it so desesperately to work-and went without filling his prescriptions. I went to a natural food store, asked what to give him, read in their reference books. Anyway, he took colloidal silver for the ear infection only for two weeks (half of an 1/8 of an adult dose diluted in water or juice 2 or 3 times/day), at night I put a vaporizer in his room with eucaliptus essencial oil -10 to 15 drops-, and also he took an expectorant -1/4 adult dose once, maybe twice a day. Him and my daughter -3 yrs and 4 mos.- also take cod oil with strawberry flavor and I also give them probiotics mix with juice or milk. when I went back to his dr. a week later, she was surprise he was healing faster that he had the first time around. I'm at peace and confident I'm doing the right thing for them by not giving them drugs. But I still haven't found a holistic pediatrician or naturopath doctor. I live upstate NY, does any one know where to look/find one? Thank you, any help is highly appreciated.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

Think First — Fri, 09 May 2008 04:31:17 GMT

I personally am a little stunned by some of the folks still buying into the whole cholesterol is evil myth. Your body needs to produce the proper amount for the hormones it needs to function normally. Your brain needs it to produce the chemicals and housekeeping to to stay sharp. It seems to me limiting this to some artificial number is by it's very nature going against keeping your body healthy and your mind sharp for a long healthy life. When the balance of our various types of cholesterol goes wacky from poor diet, lack of exercise, stress or exposure to pollutants, then we have problems. Those are facts proven in the scientific studies I have seen. When I had a heart attack, my cholesterol was 147, exercised 4 times a week but had a poor diet and was taking extra calcium as my family has a history of osteoporosis. My plaque was over 70 percent calcium, NOT cholesterol. That was only 5% of it. It is not uncommon or unusual either.

There are many natural solutions to all of the problems associated with heart disease. Since the placebo or sugar pill is almost as effective as the statin and it has no side affects, why not sell it? We have an incredible body and mind capable of doing amazing things. Yet our current medical system practices more like you'd see from evil dark ages nightmares. From slash and burn cancer treatment to hack and medicate heart treatment. Take your pick. Natural solutions worked fine for many years until it was found there was more money in little metal stents and surgery. It doesn't fix the problem, just makes everyone more money. Chemical IV's like EDTA would clean the arteries. In 1965 a cardiologist found a treatment of simple Chondroitin Sulfate in large enough doses also removed the plaque but also strengthened the arteries which all tested and performed like a 20 year olds. Pictures of 85% blockage clear and clean after three months. Wonder what happened? I think you know...

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

mschuler — Fri, 09 May 2008 04:08:27 GMT

In view of the large number of variables involved in calculating the NNT it seems like a useless number to me. I'll disregard it.

When PatriSpain says military personnel are "trained not to think for themselves" and carries on in that vein, I have to think that that is surely a naive bit of nonsense. Patri, you have an overactive imagination.You let it work for you in areas where you have no real knowledge or experience. Perhaps you confuse the idea of teamwork with that of slavish non-think obedience. You could join the army, for example, and see what military service is really like. Marvess

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

xflyboy — Thu, 08 May 2008 23:28:39 GMT

The rhetoric re. NNT in regards to statins seems creditable as far as it goes. How do you factor in the "probabilites" of a heart attack for a person who had a stent implant in a single coronary artery that was purely defensive, i.e. 70% blockage discovered following a routine medical exam? Would you expect the NNT for Zocor or Lipitor to be lower for this cicumstance? // X Flyboy

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

WEBRO — Thu, 08 May 2008 23:08:18 GMT

The Number needed to treat with Lipitor doesn't look very good when you consider only one out of a hundred will be helped. But if this is a devastating illness causing death or heart failure then maybe it’s worth it. Also, if there are 30 million people at risk of heart attack (I am guessing at the number of US citizens at risk) then treating this group will save 300,000 people from heart attack (was it over three years?). What if one extends this benefit to 30 years (40 year old on treatment for 30 years), does this multiply the benefit by at least 10? Then 3 million people will be helped. After all the risk of having a heart attack just goes up with age and is life long. I agree we need to look at drug effectiveness, but why pick on something that is useful, why not pick a useless treatment like using B-blockers for hypertension. The NNT with this treatment is infinite! It just does not work to prevent heart attack or stoke even when it controls blood pressure. This information was published in the August 14 2007 issue of the American Journal of Cardiology. One of the lessons from this is that we need to look at end points like stroke, heart attack and not secondary endpoints like blood pressure over a long period of time. The Lipitor study looked at real endpoints. Also we need to keep in mind it may take many years to see if a treatment is effective and just how effective it is. I think saving 3 million people from heart attack is pretty good, especially if one of them is me. I have high cholesterol that has been lowered by a statin. Both my brother and father had heart attacks in their early fifties. I just passed a stress test with flying colors at 53. My brother was in terrific shape and did not smoke, but he never had his cholesterol checked either. As I understand it muscle disease and liver problems are rare from Lipitor and usually detected before permanent damage is done. But there is a risk whenever you introduce a chemical into your body. I think your presentation of the facts is just as limited, if not more, than the drug companies. But I do commend you for explaining NNT, it’s just that that’s not the whole story.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

MBD — Thu, 08 May 2008 22:49:28 GMT

Stephaniered87:

I appreciate your perspective and thank you for sharing it.

My personal approach is to follow the common sense outlined by both "conventional" and "alternative" medicine, namely a balanced diet with lots of fresh fruits and vegetables, frequent exercise, sleep, practices to foster good mental health, a job I enjoy, etc. I gather that many people have appropriated these habits for the "alternative" side but I think most people would agree they make perfect sense. (Whether people actually follow them is another story.)

Doing these things (plus good genes) keeps me out of the doctors' office and from taking prescription drugs. So perhaps I've been lucky. But I like to think that if my health turned for the worse, I would be happy for the existence of surgeons, doctors, pharmacists, etc. just as I am happy for the existence of massage therapists and Whole Foods. I don't see the need to pick one or the other, but rather to use personal choice. One can reject a particular drug without condemning a whole section of the population. My brother recently decided to change his diet and exercise more rather than taking Lipitor, which I applaud. I wouldn't want to give over all decision making for my health to a surgeon, but neither would I want to give it to a chiropractor. I think more high-quality information the better, and I'll decide.

Anyway, I do appreciate your comment. My only regret is that if everybody already "knows what's right" as you say, that tends to restrict rather than encourage new points of view. One of the hallmarks of good science is that it tends to evolve over time.

But that's OK, it probably means I should spend my time on other forums where I don't collect thumbs down.

Good luck staying happy and healthy!

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

curious7 — Thu, 08 May 2008 20:43:18 GMT

Part 2:

Then there are those who suffer obesity are also suffering hypertension, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer. At the same time BIG PHARMA sticks out it's con artist chest, and boasts of the profits it has made, while HUMAN BEINGS are dying. Yet the afore mentioned Government agencies, swallow the LIE that they are not marketing SNAKE OIL. Why not err on the side of caution? Let us take the approval of so called drugs out of the hands of Government, and randomly put this very important phase of drug development in the hands of our Universities.

Same should be done with everything that comes into contact with HUMAN BEINGS, and our pets off the market until safety can be scientifically proven. Prove said item are harmless. Not wait until there have been millions of deaths to start looking at that possibility. How many people have to die for the sake of maney?

We have cell phones, and the cell phone transmission tower filling the air with harmful Electro Magnetic Fields, and our Government is AWOL. Not to mention Microwave Ovens, High tension power lines, Wi-Fi, and cordless phones. At the same time these industries say there is no scientific proof that these items are harmful. Why not err on the side of caution? Is money more important than a HUMAN life?

Then we are loosing our Honey Bees, our Bats, and our Birds at an alarming rate. Some due to GMOs, and some due to the harmful Magnetic Fields, we are creating out of the love of money. So much for a society built on a system of free markets, and capitolism. Are we really ready to give up life and health on behalf of a dollar? The answer should be no, but sadly the answer is yes. And what of our future generations, what kind of world will they be left to grow up in?

I can hear it allnow about how we are small in numbers and that those with the capitol will win in the end. Well this is true, but only if we as HUMAN BEINGS demand nothing, nothing is what we will get. Wake up.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

GARY BOOTH — Thu, 08 May 2008 20:41:52 GMT

Has anyone compiled a list of NNT numbers for common drugs? I would love to have one to shove in my HMO MD's face!

Seriously, such a list would convince a lot of people their getting bad advice, and maybe would use natural substances instead.

I take no drugs and I'm 74, and the MD keeps trying to put me on drugs. I think if they gave these drugs to animals, they would get busted for animal cruelty.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

curious7 — Thu, 08 May 2008 20:23:13 GMT

PART 1:

We have people developing chemical concoctions which time and again have proven harmful to HUMAN BEINGS. The harm has been covered up by the very agencies created to protect us from such con artists. But behold, these guys have deceided to crawl into bed with one another, and what happens, HUMAN BEINGS die. No outrage, just the luck of the draw. While BIG PHARMA, and the FDA are doing their best to keep the public in the dark the common every day people with knowledge are asleep. We do little in the way of protesting, or writing our elected representatives, to make a noise.

Then we have such things as Teflon, Aluminium, in our anti perspirants, and pots and pans, which is responsible for everything from BREAST CANCER, to ALZHEIMERS, to sexual disfunction. Yet the industry says, "there is no direct scientific proof of the dangers." We have companies marketing so called skin creams full of petro-chemicals, buttheclaim is again that there is no proof of harm. The cigarette industry used the same story line for years.

Next we have Mansanto marketing socalled Round-Up ready soybeans, and the soybeans have been genetically altered to with stand this weed killer, and our FDA, EPA, all see nothing wrong with selling this food for human consumption, and even refuse to label said foods. Again, there is no scientific proof that these GMOs are harmful. Why not err, on the side of caution? Money.

Our USDA low balls the so called RDA, or recomended daily allowences, of vitamins and minerals, to help pull the wool over the eyes of consumers concerning the foods we consume. This because the small amount of land we have left for producing food is depletted of nutriients, components need for a healthy life sustaining meal. Next we take good foods, process said foods, and market these foods as healthy, while the FTC, and the FCC, look the other way. In effect causing the numbers of people who are obese to become outrageous. Wake up America.

re: Medicine's Dirty Little Secret

Dr Rik — Thu, 08 May 2008 20:16:09 GMT

Exercise?...

...can't you just get the insurance company to pay for my drugs?

Medicare D(ope)(rugs)(ummy)